Wiring a relay to a pneumatic solenoid for mist coolant

steelcogs

steelcogs
Hi, I'm wanting to wire an air solenoid to a relay input so I can use my mister with my mill. I have this relay, and this air solenoid. I see the diagram listed under the relays section in the documentation, but I don't know how to read electrical diagrams such as that one or how I'd end up wiring my relay/solenoid. Here's how I see it so correct me if I'm wrong: Relay output 4 (tower lights are assigned to 1-3) will go to one of the pins on the relay (I have no idea which one). 24v from PSU powering the Masso goes into whichever pin on the relay is input. Air solenoid positive goes to an output pin on the relay and solenoid ground goes to...any ground? So if you can't tell I'm just mostly confused and unfortunately there aren't any Masso specific videos about this subject online. If somebody could sort of baby step me through it, that would be great lol.

I did this before on an arduino board with the grbl controller. It had 5v, ground, and signal coming from the arduino into the relay, then on the opposite end of the relay a NC connection went to the 24v PSU, and the solenoid was wired to the output(?) and ground of the PSU. IIRC grbl would send an M7 to the board enabling 5v to the relay, enabling 24v to the solenoid and opening it.

Thanks for the help in advance
 

masso-support

MASSO Support
Staff member
on the relay can you identify the two pins for the relay coil?

You need to wire one side of the relay coil to lets say Relay output no. 6 on MASSO green connector and the other side of the relay coil to the +24v of the MASSO power supply.

Next when you goto the F1-Setup screen, enter password and select Relay output no. 6, then press the space key and the relay with switch on/off. You can then assign this output as your coolant or mist output.
 

kencnc411

kencnc411
Could use some advice on wiring a Mac 35a solinoid for my fog buster system. Not a lot of documentation on power requirements etc. Anyone else using their Masso to control mist/fluid system?
 

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kencnc411

kencnc411
could use some advice on wiring a Mac 35a solinoid for my fog buster system. Not a lot of documentation on power requirements etc. Anyone else using their Masso to control mist/fluid system?
 

breezy

Arie
Staff member
You need to supply the spec sheets of the equipment that you have for us to provide wiring info. There are too many variables to give you an generic answer. The photo doesn't match what you are requesting help on, also no info on the relay!

Regards,

Arie.
 

segoman-designs

SegoMan DeSigns
@masso-support

Peter,

Are these the same relays that are used in the Arduino system with a 5V low draw coil? Or does it have to specify TTL style input for the trigger? I ask this as some listings state both Arduino & TTL inputs.

Like this:


OR this one with optocouplers:


Suggestion:

With the release of the G3 controller you need to break both the forums and documentation library with the G2 or G3 heading to save confusions between the 2. I have an unused 8 channel relay module because of this, as all TTL outputs was not mentioned on the release of the G3.

Thanks
 

cncnutz

CNCnutz
Staff member
@testyourdesign

Yes the process is the same for the G3 as the G2.

Any relay card that can be trigger with a 5 volt input does not draw more than 5mA from the Masso's output and does not send a voltage back to the Masso output will work.

Cheer Peter
 

cncnutz

CNCnutz
Staff member
@segoman-designs

TTL output is written on the G2 & G3 outputs. It is a standard used on most controllers and is the standard used on computer parallel ports so is very common in the CNC.

The problem with the cards you show is that you cannot tell unless you have the actual card and test it.

An optically isolated card should present no voltage to the Masso input and if it does it is not suitable and isn't optically isolated. Many of these cards use pull up resistors to provide a voltage for a dry contact or switch but in doing this they remove the isolation. Admittedly we do the same by connecting the card to Masso's power supply but with a properly designed card you at least have the choice to fully isolate.

Any relay card that can be trigger with a 5 volt input does not draw more than 5mA from the Masso's output and does not send a voltage back to the Masso output will work.

Cheers Peter
 

cncnutz

CNCnutz
Staff member

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segoman-designs

SegoMan DeSigns
@masso-support

Peter,

I have the Sain Smart relay in hand, the amp draw to fire the relays is 3.8 mA. Drawing T2A on page one shows no resistors in use, they are a user installed option if I'm reading it correctly.

What else do I need to check prior to hooking up with the Masso?

Thanks Mate
 

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cncnutz

CNCnutz
Staff member
@segoman-designs

Put a volt meter on your relay card inputs and make sure there is no voltage coming from the card back to Masso as you would connect it.

If there is a voltage coming from your relay board input then do not connect it to Masso TTL outputs.

Looking at your manual this card does not look like it is suitable and from what I read I think you will need to built the circuit on Page 3 Figure T4 for each input you wish to connect to Masso.

Cheers Peter
 

segoman-designs

SegoMan DeSigns
@masso-support

Peter

I have power out of the relay input pins so it is a no go even though it said TTL inputs.

Question on the relay link you posted are you using the high or low level trigger setting?

The Masso online documentation for the TTL output circuits leaves a lot of unanswered questions (A picture only don't cut it)

Details like 5V out of the TTL circuit vs ground out on the G2 relay outs, what type of TTL relay w/part #'s and what settings are required would go a long way, You guys stated you have trouble getting information from touch screen monitors mfr's for touch screen interface, well we have the same problem with you guys. From searching the forums I am not the only one having troubles specking out the correct parts to get.

Things have come a long ways since you came on board but there is still many holes in the documentation boat..

Hopefully the third time will be a charm (if / when it shows up from China)
 

cncnutz

CNCnutz
Staff member
@segoman-designs

TTL has been around since 1961 which makes it 4 years older than me and in that time it has not changed much.

It is fair to say that it is a well recognised standard and it's characteristics are well understood. The logic states are 0 volts for logic 0 and 5 volts for logic 1. Inputs are inputs and do not source voltage and outputs are outputs and do not accept voltage. You do not put extraneous voltages into outputs. You do not exceed 5 volts on an input.

Almost all CNC machines are based on TTL logic starting from the first ones using the Parallel port of a printer which is TTL. This means there is no shortage of TTL interface boards as it has been around for years, but as you have found, some sellers calling a board TTL to make a sale, makes finding a suitable board difficult. As you will find when your Chinese board arrives, if you ordered the one from the link I provided, there will be no part number on it. You will see on the sellers page he provides no part number to ensure the relay you buy this time is the same as the one you bought last time. That's the problem and why there is no part number given on the website for that board.

In answer to your question about the link position I have mine set to High. Test with a meter to ensure the board design hasn't changed and you have it set right. It always pays not to assume.

With regards the documentation I agree that it is not perfect. The TTL output page it shows a generic TTL relay board and how to connect it. It shows the correct link setting for that particular board though it may change from board to board. It provides a brief description of the output stating that it is 5mA max and because it is TTL we know it is 5 volts. There is a link to Wikipedia which explains about TTL for those who are unsure about the technology. Since part numbers are non existent and the seller can change their part or it goes out of stock at any time putting up a link to a particular seller is not ideal.

If you buy a TTL compatible relay board, no matter what one you get, it should connect and work as shown. If it has a link to switch between high and low you need to figure out the correct setting but that should be all. In defence of your board manufacture the only mention of TTL in the documentation you provided is in the word liTTLe. They do not say it is a TTL board that I can see, though the seller may have done so when you bought it.

I'm sure the new board will work well once it arrives and you will have your solenoid working in not time.

Cheers Peter
 

breezy

Arie
Staff member
@masso-support

Peter.

Your statement
Inputs are inputs and do not source voltage and outputs are outputs and do not accept voltage.

Should be added to the TTL outputs page, you can be sure not many people goto the WIKI page to read up on TTL. Even I had not read it until now and only because you pointed it out, having read it I found it heavy going, so those who know nothing about electronics would be totally lost. The above statement is simple and can be understood by all.

Regards,

Arie.
 

masso-support

MASSO Support
Staff member
Given that so many people have issues with all the non-standard and poor quality relay boards, we are releasing MASSO relay modules next month which will provide easy installation and we will also provide wiring examples. This way there won't be any confusion and we can standardize things with better quality products.
 

testyourdesign

testyourdesign
@masso-support

That is great news regarding Masso brand relay boards. I look forward to the new product release. How many relays will they include and how much current will they handle?

Cheers, Stephen Brown
 
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