Discussion about mechanical and electrical design requirments when using THC (Torch Height Control) with MASSO.
Z axis design for PLASMA (Torch Height Control) THC control
- Thread starter masso-support
- Start date
As MASSO controls the Z axis movement directly when in THC mode, the axis can be used in combination of both gcode and THC logic.
At this stage we support THC with torch UP, DOWN commands through external units such as PROMA-150 but we are also working on our own D-THC design module that will sit next to the plasma and plug back into MASSO with the below features:
At this stage we support THC with torch UP, DOWN commands through external units such as PROMA-150 but we are also working on our own D-THC design module that will sit next to the plasma and plug back into MASSO with the below features:
- Self powered unit from MASSO's power supply requiring no external power source.
- Fully optically isolate unit for electrical noise protection and isolation.
- Input for ARC OK signal.
- Relay output to start/stop plasma arc.
- Arc voltage input from plasma 1:50 voltage divider.
- Status LED's.
- To be able to set the required THC height via gcode using gcode S command.
- Real-time height override option via MASSO screen.
Actually THC has been on a low priority due to so much other working going on with controllers, so at this stage there is no set date, sorry.
When I was recently rebuilding the 19 year old cnc plasma, now with the Masso controller.
I ordered a Price THC as a backup if I couldn't get the spare Technogon THC operating.
In bench testing it seemed to work, then all of a sudden, it shut down.
Doesn't read anything now.
(now to send it back to them for repairs)
No doubt the Price is a good unit, just something didn't stack up.
Now using a self built unit in stand alone mode.
I'm really interested to see if an integrated unit can be offered with the Masso.
Life is not the same without the Technogon unit.
Cheers.
I ordered a Price THC as a backup if I couldn't get the spare Technogon THC operating.
In bench testing it seemed to work, then all of a sudden, it shut down.
Doesn't read anything now.
(now to send it back to them for repairs)
No doubt the Price is a good unit, just something didn't stack up.
Now using a self built unit in stand alone mode.
I'm really interested to see if an integrated unit can be offered with the Masso.
Life is not the same without the Technogon unit.
Cheers.
Yes that is the plan, we were working on a THC module that can be plugged to MASSO for this but are so busy with the sales and support that its been put on hold.
Ross
Ross
I myself will probably buy one.
It will have to handle raw voltage to suit my machine (plus Jim Colt from Hypertherm states raw voltage is a better way to go than 50 to 1 divider)
Maybe we need a numbers count for those who want one, just so Masso can understand how important this is!
From Ross.
It will have to handle raw voltage to suit my machine (plus Jim Colt from Hypertherm states raw voltage is a better way to go than 50 to 1 divider)
Maybe we need a numbers count for those who want one, just so Masso can understand how important this is!
From Ross.
the problem is not the proma or the up down inputs . the controller does not simply have the controls on the screen to control plasma THC.and never will till masso addes them
right now I ben talking to an oem plasma table builder .he cant make the thc work right ready to trash the masso for an ESS or vitalsystems ..
and ross raw voltage is a big no no. you did not hear that from jim colt . every hypertherm has a voltage devider in the plasma unit .raw voltage will caus interfierance ..
cheap china units like the everlast don't have devider .
right now I ben talking to an oem plasma table builder .he cant make the thc work right ready to trash the masso for an ESS or vitalsystems ..
and ross raw voltage is a big no no. you did not hear that from jim colt . every hypertherm has a voltage devider in the plasma unit .raw voltage will caus interfierance ..
cheap china units like the everlast don't have devider .
Ross it not the controller the controller runs fine .. what masso did was take the mill features and add plasma . not being plasma guys they thaught the THC would
be simple so they lacked the controls to control it on screen and in the program . THC voltages change with velocity slow down . circles steel warppage
and many other reasons . masso has no way to over look a voltage change . no anti dive feature and other things like mach has and onter controller builders
if you looking to get a good plasma controller . I sugest a vital systems hicon mini swift cut uses them . thers an ESS warp 9 with there TMC3 THC these are the only
mach 4 plasma controllers that THC works well .. you can down load mach4 free demo there plasma screen and see the settings the used on the screen I sugest masso to do the same add that to there controller for plasma ..
another route is a uccnc controller and software and run a nuron thc unit this is a very good many oem use nuron and you have command cnc Linux
if your looking for a ohmic unit check Robot 3t
lots of us plasma guys share information on face book the cnc plasma good bad ugly . cnc plasma table builders
I been do plasma table designes for several years now I tried lots of controllers and motor . I build gear reduction units .Z axcess and every other part hear a pic of a build with a Z axis
I realy have heigh hopes masso can build a good plasma controller . like I said it does run.. a little slow loading large codes compaired to a pc based unit .. it just the thc part that not up to par .
be simple so they lacked the controls to control it on screen and in the program . THC voltages change with velocity slow down . circles steel warppage
and many other reasons . masso has no way to over look a voltage change . no anti dive feature and other things like mach has and onter controller builders
if you looking to get a good plasma controller . I sugest a vital systems hicon mini swift cut uses them . thers an ESS warp 9 with there TMC3 THC these are the only
mach 4 plasma controllers that THC works well .. you can down load mach4 free demo there plasma screen and see the settings the used on the screen I sugest masso to do the same add that to there controller for plasma ..
another route is a uccnc controller and software and run a nuron thc unit this is a very good many oem use nuron and you have command cnc Linux
if your looking for a ohmic unit check Robot 3t
lots of us plasma guys share information on face book the cnc plasma good bad ugly . cnc plasma table builders
I been do plasma table designes for several years now I tried lots of controllers and motor . I build gear reduction units .Z axcess and every other part hear a pic of a build with a Z axis
I realy have heigh hopes masso can build a good plasma controller . like I said it does run.. a little slow loading large codes compaired to a pc based unit .. it just the thc part that not up to par .
Attachments
Ross
Ross
Jcoldon, My problem is the Masso cost me over a $1000 dollars (cost of unit, postage and the heavy tax in Thailand) Masso sells a unit stating they sell a unit suited for plasma and is can't handle a simple THC.
My wife works 3 jobs and is the sole provider in our family and you know what wagers are like in a third world country, what you make in a day takes us nearly a month! This is to get an understanding how much this has cost us.
If they fix the problem I am happy, but if they can't I am looking at a new controller from a different company, How am I going to say to the wife give me another $1000 or more to replace the Masso cause it won't do the job it was bent for. Yer divorce papers that's what I will get.
That is were I am now, A plasma table that can't be used and a wife that is nagging me to get this thing working cause it has taken to long.
If Masso doesn't fix the problem they can ask my wife "Hay give Ross a $1000 to buy a different controller so he can get the cnc table working" cause I'm not brave enough for that.
And this is were I am at now!
From Ross.
My wife works 3 jobs and is the sole provider in our family and you know what wagers are like in a third world country, what you make in a day takes us nearly a month! This is to get an understanding how much this has cost us.
If they fix the problem I am happy, but if they can't I am looking at a new controller from a different company, How am I going to say to the wife give me another $1000 or more to replace the Masso cause it won't do the job it was bent for. Yer divorce papers that's what I will get.
That is were I am now, A plasma table that can't be used and a wife that is nagging me to get this thing working cause it has taken to long.
If Masso doesn't fix the problem they can ask my wife "Hay give Ross a $1000 to buy a different controller so he can get the cnc table working" cause I'm not brave enough for that.
And this is were I am at now!
From Ross.
@ross firstly sorry, just saw the messages now, all our forum notifications for some reason started going into spam folders and we missed all notifications.
I can totally understand your frustration and we are happy to help you on skype or something direct to find/fix the issue, for this we need quick communication and this will help you get the machine running on priority. Also, be assured that we will do our best to get your machine running on priority and if we cant then will issue you a full refund on the unit.
please email on support your skype ID and a time that works for you and will start working on this from today only.
I can totally understand your frustration and we are happy to help you on skype or something direct to find/fix the issue, for this we need quick communication and this will help you get the machine running on priority. Also, be assured that we will do our best to get your machine running on priority and if we cant then will issue you a full refund on the unit.
please email on support your skype ID and a time that works for you and will start working on this from today only.
For all out there, Masso is not the sole achiever for your dreams.
Something like this comes around very rarely.
It is actually a good quality product, you just got to know how to work it for your advantage.
I've been working the Masso 5 axis controller since May last year.
As it didn't seem to work with up / down signals from the voltage divider.
I substituted the Z axis to another self supported, so in reality a 4th axis was created.
I can use the Z axis in 3D with X and Y and the 4th axis, standalone supported corrects any irregularities in the cutting process.
After nearly 23 years trying to get what I want, your input for your desired result is what is needed.
It didn't accept my own build of a THC, but neither did many other controllers I tried.
My THC is designed around an up / down read of 0.03 volts of the divided voltage from the Cebora Prof 122 machine.
The 0.03 volt is equivalent to 0.3 mm of travel between the up / down signals.
This THC was specifically designed for fine 3D TIG welding but found it worked in Plasma for my application.
Such a great cut with the smoothness of The Masso.
All technology has to worked to suit your application, this actually takes a lot of work.
Cheers.
Something like this comes around very rarely.
It is actually a good quality product, you just got to know how to work it for your advantage.
I've been working the Masso 5 axis controller since May last year.
As it didn't seem to work with up / down signals from the voltage divider.
I substituted the Z axis to another self supported, so in reality a 4th axis was created.
I can use the Z axis in 3D with X and Y and the 4th axis, standalone supported corrects any irregularities in the cutting process.
After nearly 23 years trying to get what I want, your input for your desired result is what is needed.
It didn't accept my own build of a THC, but neither did many other controllers I tried.
My THC is designed around an up / down read of 0.03 volts of the divided voltage from the Cebora Prof 122 machine.
The 0.03 volt is equivalent to 0.3 mm of travel between the up / down signals.
This THC was specifically designed for fine 3D TIG welding but found it worked in Plasma for my application.
Such a great cut with the smoothness of The Masso.
All technology has to worked to suit your application, this actually takes a lot of work.
Cheers.
segoman-designs
SegoMan DeSigns
Lilow,
Would you care to go a little further into the details of your THC set-up?
Thanks Man.
Would you care to go a little further into the details of your THC set-up?
Thanks Man.
In response to SegoMan DeSigns.
Below is a link to build your own THC, this works apparently with Mack3 software.
By Art Fenerty.
My photos shown is what I have able to do with it, the best thing is that it describes how to set up a comparator board to recognise the voltage divider that is selected.
It even shows how to build a divider board to suit the cutting voltage of your Plasma machine.
Don't get me wrong, it takes a lot of time to get your head around this.
After many trials, I have found the solution for both Plasma and Tig welding.
At this stage until I purchase another 5 axis Masso to play with, then I will know seriously if I can work the Masso completely.
For now I achieve perfect cutting with working in stand alone mode.
Price THC, THC3T-02, and a few others should be able to do it in this way.
Photo shown is what I have to do to develop what I actually need.
It all started with the second photo, some type of voltage comparator.
Cheers.
Lilow.
Below is a link to build your own THC, this works apparently with Mack3 software.
By Art Fenerty.
Hobby metalwork, CNC Plasma cutting, tools and a Kit Carhttps://tamarisktechnicals.com/
My photos shown is what I have able to do with it, the best thing is that it describes how to set up a comparator board to recognise the voltage divider that is selected.
It even shows how to build a divider board to suit the cutting voltage of your Plasma machine.
Don't get me wrong, it takes a lot of time to get your head around this.
After many trials, I have found the solution for both Plasma and Tig welding.
At this stage until I purchase another 5 axis Masso to play with, then I will know seriously if I can work the Masso completely.
For now I achieve perfect cutting with working in stand alone mode.
Price THC, THC3T-02, and a few others should be able to do it in this way.
Photo shown is what I have to do to develop what I actually need.
It all started with the second photo, some type of voltage comparator.
Cheers.
Lilow.
Attachments
Now just to let you know what you have to in this world.
Masso has delivered a great product.
This is what I
have had to go through to get what I want.
Two videos shown.
The photo is of a silent motion drive, more smoother than gears.
Seems as though I can't up load a video.
So I will put up a silent motion drive done 6 years ago.
Masso has delivered a great product.
This is what I
have had to go through to get what I want.
Two videos shown.
The photo is of a silent motion drive, more smoother than gears.
Seems as though I can't up load a video.
So I will put up a silent motion drive done 6 years ago.
